Great definition of counterculture by Ted. It’s not enough for a writer to be hipsterishly arrogant and dismissive of the mainstream; for their writing to have any value, they’ve got to provide an alternative to the mainstream. Otherwise, they’re just naysayers, and we have got enough of those, don’t we?
Yeah that was interesting, but I wonder if counter culture in fact exists. It is based on the idea that there is a main, prevailing culture. And I think that that culture is broken and fractured. Each person's idea of culture is an individual media , email, feed, and is different to the next person. However, I thoroughly enjoyed the podcast. It certainly proves, that authenticity, quality and individual opinions will not go out of fashion because of AI
So much here! I particularly like what they said about “content.” It’s become a loaded term, we all hear that content is king and so on, meaning that you just need to put out more more more, record everything and post it online, get clicks and eyeballs, all that garbo. Unfortunately, in some contexts, on some algorithms, that is the way of it. I appreciate substack because that isn’t the case, and I love how Ted said that you need to be careful for people who use the term “content” and aren’t looking for originality, quality, creativity, these kinds of things. I’d rather watch 3 good minutes than 30 filler minutes.
And that’s how I run my ‘stack. Might post 3 times a week or 3 times a month, but it’ll be something I poured myself into, not spit out for the sake of content.
I’ve been very careful when using the word “content” in my posts and online interactions. It’s such an easy word to use that I sometimes fall into the lazy habit of employing it to refer to anything creative and generative. I did an interview last week in which I first referred to a writer’s poetry collection as a product. I rewrote it multiple times before I was able to remove the nasty word😂
Frequency has been on my mind too. I imagine it has its place, especially if you have a large and/or paying following. It’s a tough one though because I can see two camps that I largely agree with around this topic, even though they’re conflicting.
1. Don’t worry about frequency and instead find your rhythm, write for the love of it and something good is bound to come some day.
2. Be disciplined, make a posting schedule and meet that schedule come hell or high water. Pretend writing and publishing your work is your job and act as if it is. That way, the structure and the disciple guarantee some sort of forward movement, even if it’s just consistent creation and discipline.
Don’t know which I like, I like them both. So I guess I’m not help 😂 but that’s what’s been on my mind around frequency lately.
This is a great conversation. I came in as a subscriber to Ted and found myself subscribing to Mike as well. These are such important discussions, even for 70 yr old poet/musicians like me.
I have always written about my experiences of being an imperfect human, experiences not generated for SEO or to influence or sell products.
Due to some of those chaotic life experiences, I took a two year hiatus from writing online. I came back in December 2022 to bots telling me my sentences are unclear." Good. My life is unclear. It's messy. It's fucked up. It's beautiful. It's emotional. It's not roBOTic.
I don't write "content" for bots. I write for me--what makes me laugh, cry, rage... I write for other twisted humans who feel life and are willing to admit life's not easy.
I'll keep doing what I do.
Early on, growing up in what was considered the "counterculture" to young San Franciscan parents in the 1960s, I paid attention. When masses try to counter a culture, they become just as manipulated as what they were trying to flee (1950s conformity, aka robotic life).
I'll just keep writing those things that get me (a fucked up human) excited to write.
it seems to me that what we're talking about is wisdom
i don't mean that as a platitude or a religious or even philosophical term but let's call it authentic insight / that's what people crave and that's what is so often missing in our media 'content'
it can be very simple / infact wisdom is often simple
it can also be book length like 'the dawn of everything' or to beat my own drum 'the ancient book of magic secrets' which i'm releasing soon as a self-published title / all about being human (hey what else do i know)
Loved the bit about ‘content’ being something people do to get lots of attention without adding too much value. I hope that our attention as consumers of online ‘content’ will get more refined with the time and we won’t be as easily manipulated. It’s a paradox that we people generally dislike attention seekers and at the same time support them everywhere, be it online or offline.
Was sort of interested in Ted Gioia as a writer abt jazz, but reading a dialogue (kind of) like the above, in which the other participant is barely literate let alone understandable, makes you realise how much of Substack time is time wasted on ego-centred ranting. (Yes, you don’t have to read everything but finding what you want to read takes time.)
Hi Graeme, we publish “Quotes from the conversation” instead of the full transcript to highlight key moments throughout the episode. But if this is something you're keen to see in future podcast posts it's certainly an idea we can take on board!
Cool, thank you. I struggle to focus listening to podcasts and recognise I'm missing a wealth of good stuff, so it's definitely something I'd be interested in.
Wouldnt that be something. I guess i can help Ted with that. But it is so annoying that we cant tag writers here. I cant understand why substack hasnt sorted this tagging thing on still. Its killing user engagement and after 5 years since launch they still havent thought about this feature to tag a user.
Well, to write about a music genre you need to be interested in it. Not sure if helping Ted G. would help. 😂
I know about the tagging. Wanted to mention a writer of fiction who has a Substack and a love for rap music. Even though I’m not so interested in rap, he’s articles are so good that I’m changing my mind about this music genre. But yeah, no tagging feature 🫥
Music is Music. House music is jazzy too. I guess Ted needs to discover it. Yeah it’s so bloody annoying that Substack team still haven’t figured this out. What a shitshow.
Great conversation. Love the definition of counterculture and how it applies on Substack. And really painfully resonate with the aspect on “content” because I am a writer first but in order to make a living have also had to be a content creator and these are different things. I’m glad it’s changing even as I sometimes get nervous about the financial side of that for me.
Thanks. For a time I was writing so much “content” to pay the bills that I felt like I completely lost my creative voice. I had to take a step back and write more authentically just for myself to break out of the habits of short sentences, transitional phrases and keyword plugging that was required for online writing jobs. I would love to hear more about your readjustment if you care to share ❤️
Great definition of counterculture by Ted. It’s not enough for a writer to be hipsterishly arrogant and dismissive of the mainstream; for their writing to have any value, they’ve got to provide an alternative to the mainstream. Otherwise, they’re just naysayers, and we have got enough of those, don’t we?
Ted and Mike are legends. Two must reads on substack. Glad they could banter here about the counter culture!
If Mike is a legend we're in much deeper caca than first perceived. Talk about out to lunch...
love my fans
Yeah that was interesting, but I wonder if counter culture in fact exists. It is based on the idea that there is a main, prevailing culture. And I think that that culture is broken and fractured. Each person's idea of culture is an individual media , email, feed, and is different to the next person. However, I thoroughly enjoyed the podcast. It certainly proves, that authenticity, quality and individual opinions will not go out of fashion because of AI
So much here! I particularly like what they said about “content.” It’s become a loaded term, we all hear that content is king and so on, meaning that you just need to put out more more more, record everything and post it online, get clicks and eyeballs, all that garbo. Unfortunately, in some contexts, on some algorithms, that is the way of it. I appreciate substack because that isn’t the case, and I love how Ted said that you need to be careful for people who use the term “content” and aren’t looking for originality, quality, creativity, these kinds of things. I’d rather watch 3 good minutes than 30 filler minutes.
And that’s how I run my ‘stack. Might post 3 times a week or 3 times a month, but it’ll be something I poured myself into, not spit out for the sake of content.
I’ve been very careful when using the word “content” in my posts and online interactions. It’s such an easy word to use that I sometimes fall into the lazy habit of employing it to refer to anything creative and generative. I did an interview last week in which I first referred to a writer’s poetry collection as a product. I rewrote it multiple times before I was able to remove the nasty word😂
‘Spit out for the sake of content’ such a good remark. The topic of frequency of publishing has been on my mind lately.
Frequency has been on my mind too. I imagine it has its place, especially if you have a large and/or paying following. It’s a tough one though because I can see two camps that I largely agree with around this topic, even though they’re conflicting.
1. Don’t worry about frequency and instead find your rhythm, write for the love of it and something good is bound to come some day.
2. Be disciplined, make a posting schedule and meet that schedule come hell or high water. Pretend writing and publishing your work is your job and act as if it is. That way, the structure and the disciple guarantee some sort of forward movement, even if it’s just consistent creation and discipline.
Don’t know which I like, I like them both. So I guess I’m not help 😂 but that’s what’s been on my mind around frequency lately.
You know, I had decided for myself that I will write at my own pace and publish when a new piece is ready.
But after reading your comment, I am questioning my decisions. When I started my Substacks I wrote on a schedule and it made me more productive.
It's just that now that I switched to writing fiction, this is not possible any longer. 😫 So hard to take a decision!
I try not to listen to two men talking but damn this was a fantastic, nuanced, insightful conversation.
Sexist comment by stunning and brave Tawny. Would you be ok with someone saying "I try not to listen to two women talking"?
haha where's my laughing emoji ?? oh right we're on substack and i hate emojis
This is a great conversation. I came in as a subscriber to Ted and found myself subscribing to Mike as well. These are such important discussions, even for 70 yr old poet/musicians like me.
https://bobmetivier.substack.com/
You might get a kick out of this poem before I listened to this podcast:
https://bobmetivier.substack.com/p/the-gatekeeper
I have always written about my experiences of being an imperfect human, experiences not generated for SEO or to influence or sell products.
Due to some of those chaotic life experiences, I took a two year hiatus from writing online. I came back in December 2022 to bots telling me my sentences are unclear." Good. My life is unclear. It's messy. It's fucked up. It's beautiful. It's emotional. It's not roBOTic.
I don't write "content" for bots. I write for me--what makes me laugh, cry, rage... I write for other twisted humans who feel life and are willing to admit life's not easy.
I'll keep doing what I do.
Early on, growing up in what was considered the "counterculture" to young San Franciscan parents in the 1960s, I paid attention. When masses try to counter a culture, they become just as manipulated as what they were trying to flee (1950s conformity, aka robotic life).
I'll just keep writing those things that get me (a fucked up human) excited to write.
Absolutely adding this in my list.
i enjoyed the conversation / hope you do more
it seems to me that what we're talking about is wisdom
i don't mean that as a platitude or a religious or even philosophical term but let's call it authentic insight / that's what people crave and that's what is so often missing in our media 'content'
it can be very simple / infact wisdom is often simple
it can also be book length like 'the dawn of everything' or to beat my own drum 'the ancient book of magic secrets' which i'm releasing soon as a self-published title / all about being human (hey what else do i know)
off to subscribe to pirate wires
Loved the bit about ‘content’ being something people do to get lots of attention without adding too much value. I hope that our attention as consumers of online ‘content’ will get more refined with the time and we won’t be as easily manipulated. It’s a paradox that we people generally dislike attention seekers and at the same time support them everywhere, be it online or offline.
Was sort of interested in Ted Gioia as a writer abt jazz, but reading a dialogue (kind of) like the above, in which the other participant is barely literate let alone understandable, makes you realise how much of Substack time is time wasted on ego-centred ranting. (Yes, you don’t have to read everything but finding what you want to read takes time.)
from where does the urge to comment something like this come from but ego?
I was wondering the same thing, since I got no sense of driving ego from this conversation. It seemed to be a relevant and needed conversation.
Is there a transcript, please?
Hi Graeme, we publish “Quotes from the conversation” instead of the full transcript to highlight key moments throughout the episode. But if this is something you're keen to see in future podcast posts it's certainly an idea we can take on board!
Cool, thank you. I struggle to focus listening to podcasts and recognise I'm missing a wealth of good stuff, so it's definitely something I'd be interested in.
While I enjoy some of Ted’s Jazz stuff, he should write about House Music and I’ll be happy to collaborate 😃
😂 Would definitely read Ted G.’s insights into House Music of he were listening to it. It would be a unique take.
Wouldnt that be something. I guess i can help Ted with that. But it is so annoying that we cant tag writers here. I cant understand why substack hasnt sorted this tagging thing on still. Its killing user engagement and after 5 years since launch they still havent thought about this feature to tag a user.
Well, to write about a music genre you need to be interested in it. Not sure if helping Ted G. would help. 😂
I know about the tagging. Wanted to mention a writer of fiction who has a Substack and a love for rap music. Even though I’m not so interested in rap, he’s articles are so good that I’m changing my mind about this music genre. But yeah, no tagging feature 🫥
Music is Music. House music is jazzy too. I guess Ted needs to discover it. Yeah it’s so bloody annoying that Substack team still haven’t figured this out. What a shitshow.
Great conversation. Love the definition of counterculture and how it applies on Substack. And really painfully resonate with the aspect on “content” because I am a writer first but in order to make a living have also had to be a content creator and these are different things. I’m glad it’s changing even as I sometimes get nervous about the financial side of that for me.
Thanks. For a time I was writing so much “content” to pay the bills that I felt like I completely lost my creative voice. I had to take a step back and write more authentically just for myself to break out of the habits of short sentences, transitional phrases and keyword plugging that was required for online writing jobs. I would love to hear more about your readjustment if you care to share ❤️
Anyone who feels the need to use the F word in his twitter timeline has immediately lost my interest.
lol
And as for authors— I would argue that YA and fantasy writers now have the most influence, not literary fiction writers. This seems appropriate.
Lit fiction has long been captured by MFA/elitist doublethink/thought police.
Great compass. Adopting. Be F*cking Amazing. BFA.
"Content" is the flattest word ever created. It's like "boutique" but with a lot more downside.